Subj: Re: My Dad Died Yesterday Morning.
Date: 1/28/00 7:06:02 AM Pacific Standard Time
From: RevRayJoseph@reformed.com (Raymond P. Joseph)
To: KEVIN4VFT@aol.com (Kevin Craig)

Dear Kevin,

My own father died in 1987, at the age of 91,
after losing his bout with Parkinson's disease.
[Mother had died of cancer in 1972, at the
age of 75.]

(Dad's head hung down; his jaw was slack; he had
little muscular control; my brother and I visited him
in the Marion Iowa hospital, then contacted
his Christian doctor in a conference call, after we
learned that that he had had to bring Dad out of a convulsion;
we both told him that the next time Dad has a terminal
convulsion, to just let him go. Three weeks later
I spoke at Dad's funeral in Hopkinton Iowa.
His Christian doctor then wrote us a moving attribution
to the kind of man our Dad was.)

My question to you: You mentioned the "alternative
treatment" for cancer. Could you detail that just a bit?

Most of all, what is your opinion of "alternative treatments"
for cancer ? My own thought is that the accepted radiation
and chemotherapy not only often does not work, but that
the "cure" may be worse than the disease. If one has to go
through that, then one could be excused for thinking that
they would rather just let the cancer take its course.

Or, better, try an "alternative therapy", which with prayer,
may move the LORD to heal one from cancer, thus giving
more years of relatively healthful living.

Losing one's Dad is always a traumatic experience, although
for Christians it is certainly ameliorated by faith in Christ for what lies
ahead the other side of the grave.

May our LORD be with you ...

Ray Joseph

==============================
BELIEVE IN BIBLICAL KINGDOM VICTORY !
(-- BEFORE -- Christ's return !)
"All ends of earth, rememb'ring Him,
Shall turn themselves unto the LORD.
The kindreds of the nations then
To Him their homage shall accord.
Because the LORD the kingdom owns
And rules above all earthly thrones"
-- Psalm 22I, ST12. "Psalms For Singing."

For the 21st Century Victory
of Christ's Crown and Covenant
over the nations ...

Ray Joseph, pastor

Southfield RPC
26580 Evergreen Road
SFLD MICH 48076
Ph: 248 356-3932

revrayjoseph@reformed.com
(E-mail address.)

http://www.reformed.com
(Our Southfield web site.)

http://www.reformed.com/rpcna/const/ct_chp23.htm
(The RPCNA Declaration & Testimony on national
covenanting.)

http://www.NatReformAssn.org/
(National Reform Association web site.
The N.R.A. was founded by the RPCNA
in 1864.)

----- Original Message -----
From:
To:
Sent: Friday, January 28, 2000 2:58 AM
Subject: My Dad Died Yesterday Morning.


> Theonomy-L submission from KEVIN4VFT@aol.com
>
> In a message dated 1/27/00 1:44:57 PM Pacific Standard Time,
> nebarry@earthlink.net writes:
>
> > Kevin, first of all my prayers are with you during this difficult
> > time. I would like to share a bit with you (how's that for wimpy
> > evanjellyfish language, but seriously...) both from my personal
> > experience in dealing with the illnesses of all our parents (my
> > mother-in-law died 12/18 after a protracted illness), and also
> > professionally from my time as a hospice chaplain.
>
> Hey NorthEast! Great to hear from you! I really appreciate
> your taking the time to share from your experience.
> I'm sorry I didn't get the latest news posted sooner,
> it would have saved you some time.
>
> Dad died yesterday morning. (1-26) The night before
> he thrashed about, trying to rip his gown off and get
> out of bed. These agitated protests had become
> quite common the last few weeks. I told him that
> if he wanted out of his bed, he would have to relax
> and let God get him out. God is good. Trust Him.
> His arms fell to his sides and he relaxed. That
> was the last I saw him. I believe he trusted in God,
> and I rejoice in His great love and mercy
>
>
>
>
> > This level of care can be very difficult over a period of time. Is it
> > possible for you to have home health aids or other caregivers come in
> > and give you respite?
>
> It probably would have been. Or perhaps this care is available
> only to those who believe death is imminent. We didn't think this.
>
> I hate dealing with the bureaucrats and quibbling over
> whether insurance will cover this or that. If I had contacted
> the hospital I might have been able to get some help,
> I don't know. Next time I hear of someone going through
> my same mess, I'll know where to go. I've found out
> that many of the hospice people are very special people,
> but I knew next to nothing about this three days ago.
>
> > Well, the lawyers are not telling the doctors this, but the doctors
> > and nurses have certain legal questions that they must ask a family
> > when they suspect that a patient may be terminal. They do it both to
> > protect the institution as well as the family.
>
> We had absolutely no clue my dad was anywhere near "terminal."
> We were exhausted caring for him precisly because he was
> strong as a horse (relatively speaking). They said he had three
> days to live, and they were right (I think -- I have to admit I
> harbor all kinds of dark suspicions), but even the night before
> he died, I was so worried that this was going to go on for
> weeks. He seemed so strong and active.
>
> >
> > As I understand it, a will, living or otherwise, is not legally
> > binding in these cases. De facto POA falls on the closest living
> > family members, who may instruct the doctors to take whatever measures
> > are necessary.
>
> This is true. The doctors gave us an entirely new spin on
> the legalese in my dad's will. We were caught off guard.
> We didn't know what decisions to make, though we knew
> we had power to make them.
>
> > > We had hopes that the "alternative treatment"
> > > my dad is undergoing will cure his cancer.
> > > No illusions, but hope. The treatment has had
> > > remarkable success. We were quite impressed
> > > with their facility in Houston, and it isn't like
> > > going to a back alley in Tijuana for apricot pits.
> >
> > > http://www.cancermed.com/
> >
> > I am not going to critique or defend your treatment decisions. I do
> > encourage you to get as much medical advice as possible from competent
> > and accredited professionals.
>
> Well, the immediate crisis has passed. but the issue could
> be confronted again, because the basic forces are still at work.
> "Accredited" is in the eyes of the accreditor. From the Latin
> "credo," as you well know, we believed in our alternative
> treatment. Check the website, Barry, and I think you'll find
> it believable. The hospital doctors were simply unwilling
> to even consider the possibility that Burzynski was
> believable. And since they believed THEY could not
> cure his cancer, they believed dad was "incurable"
> and his condition "irreversible," and so their last days
> madness kicked in. Now as it turned out, at least
> according to them (they refused to take a cat scan)
> the cancer had advanced dramatically (because the
> alternative treatment had commenced too late). But
> if this was true, we didn't understand this, and the
> doctors did a lousy job of communicating this to us.
> They could have said, "We checked out Burzynski's
> program, and it looks like it would have worked if you
> had started it a few months earlier." Their credibility
> would have been enhanced by light years had
> they taken that approach instead of "you have
> the right to feel good about anything you
> choose to believe in, no matter how incredible."
>
> > Contact the hospital's patient advocate. Chaplaincy might also be
> > able to help clarify matters and communicate your wishes to the
> > doctor.
>
> Good advice. I'll file it. But after a month of in-home care,
> a week of Alzheimer's-like conflict with dad, and then
> the 911 call, I was simply exhuasted. I needed an
> advocate to help me find an advocate! :-)
>
> I have to admit the thought of calling a chaplain never
> occurred to me. I assumed they were all liberal methodists
> or something.
>
> > It should be possible to arrange hospice at home. I know nothing
> > about the programs in your area. For patient to sign hospice, there
> > must be a doctor's order stating that the patient has 6 months or less
> > to live, and that no treatment has any reasonable chance of success.
> > The patient or POA must really agree to no life-saving measures (i.e.,
> > you don't call 911 or put the patient in the hospital regardless of
> > the presenting difficulty).
>
> We really didn't want hospice. We were too weak to dig for
> alternatives. Dad seemed so peaceful and pain-free at the
> hospital. I don't understand why they couldn't have relieved
> the pain and pursued alternative treatments for an extended
> time (i.e., a month or so.). If being doped for a month would
> give me a few more years, I would take it. They said he
> was too restless to take a cat-scan, which is true, he
> was restless. But they certainly could have taken one
> after they put him under and then compared that with
> the scans taken in Houston at Burzynski's clinic and
> the one before we left, to assess the progress of
> the alternative treatment. But they had no desire
> to vindicate an unaccredited treatment.
>
> > Consider it done.
>
> I really do appreciate all the prayers and emails I have
> received. This internet contraption is such a blessing.
>
> > If you wish further information, both Shari and I will be glad to help
> > you as much as we can.
>
> I just put your numbers in my rolodex. I appreciate
> your taking time to share your counsel.
>
> I am so thankful for everyone's support and for those who wrote me.
>
> Thanks again for your friendship and prayers.
>
>
> Kevin C.
> http://members.aol.com/xmaspiracy/3/humble.htm
> ---------------------------------------------
>
> And they shall beat their swords into plowshares
> and sit under their Vine & Fig Tree.
> Micah 4:1-7
>
> submissions to Theonomy-L@dlh.com miscellaneous requests to dlh@dlh.com



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From: "Raymond P. Joseph"
To: "Kevin Craig"
References: <2d.847a52.25c2a620@aol.com>
Subject: Re: My Dad Died Yesterday Morning.
Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 10:07:57 -0500
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